Author Topic: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )  (Read 87333 times)

Offline Doug Rose

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #780 on: January 04, 2018, 07:55:15 PM »
Weather events do not kill people. Personal responsibility, life experiences, proper equipment, having a high respect for the situation and sometimes a bit of good luck keeps people safe and alive in weather conditions. It's just not right to blame any weather event for a death. Every person has a choice, many choices at any point in time, and choosing wisely is always the best bet for staying alive. Not a guarantee but it raised the odds significantly. Speed, poor tires, following too close, not being highly aware of all nearby vehicles movements and lack of experienced driving in snow were most likely the cause, not the weather. Accidents are just that, accidents, regardless of choices made and not being poorly prepared to handle a situation only increases the chance of an accident, some of which are fatal. It's life and in life, stuff happens.

It's irresponsible for the Governor or anyone else to blame a snow storm on a death. Did he do that becasue his state did not have the equipment to plow, sand and salt the roads? Yeah, probably. But why would NC spend the money on that equipment when it shows but once every 20 years. The governor should have led with the facts and not passed the buck on a weather event. Just saying . . .

as Groucho Marx put it,  “that is the most ridiculous  thing I have ever hoid of.” Weather events do not kill people? That is just a ludicrous statement. Guns don’t kill its the bullets that do, right?  What the XXXX !!.....Kidamazed
« Last Edit: January 04, 2018, 09:08:05 PM by TelePlay »
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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #781 on: January 04, 2018, 08:19:17 PM »
as Groucho Marx put it,  “that is the most ridiculous  thing I have ever hoid of.” Weather events do not kill people? That is just a ludicrous statement. Guns don’t kill its the bullets that do, right?  wth!
I think John is saying that weather events do not kill people directly. In Northern states, we almost never have a fatality during a snowstorm, since people living up here are better prepared for a snowstorm, and know how to drive in snow and ice. In Southern states, in the event of a freak snowstorm, people are more likely to be killed, since they don't know how to adapt to Winter driving. It's not the snowstorm that kills, it's almost always more directly a human factor involved.

It's like the "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" argument, but that's another can of worms. Let's try not to open that up, nor let this go in the direction of a polarized argument. :)
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Offline Doug Rose

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #782 on: January 04, 2018, 08:31:59 PM »
Hurricanes in  Puerto Rico, Florida,  Texas...past in New Orleans. Fires in CA drought. Rationalize it any way until you have lost a loved one in a weather related instance. Think about it. I just disagree..Doug
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Offline jsowers

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #783 on: January 04, 2018, 09:33:00 PM »
It snows more often than every 20 years in Raleigh and Carthage where one of the accidents took place. They've had some very bad snows in that area over the years and they should have the equipment to plow snow. But in this case it was ice on a bridge that caused the accident. A truck with two men skidded on an icy bridge. Yes, they could have been going too fast or had bald tires or any number of things, but the weather was a contributing factor and they broke through the guardrail and landed in the creek upside down in the icy water. Both men were found dead when the truck was pulled out of the creek. Below is a picture of the truck before it was pulled out.

About the "weather bomb" thing, that was repeated often on The Weather Channel. I heard it several times. Not that WC isn't guilty of being sensational. It thrives on sensationalism. So it wasn't just social media. It was also called a "bomb cyclone" in the Washington Post.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/capital-weather-gang/wp/2018/01/04/historic-bomb-cyclone-unleashes-blizzard-conditions-from-coastal-virginia-to-new-england-frigid-air-to-follow/?utm_term=.147a18d090ae

Just setting the record straight.
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Offline TelePlay

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #784 on: January 04, 2018, 09:55:08 PM »
Hurricanes in  Puerto Rico, Florida,  Texas...past in New Orleans. Fires in CA drought. Rationalize it any way until you have lost a loved one in a weather related instance. Think about it. I just disagree..Doug

Thought about it, going with what Christian said. And, none of the above would have resulted in a death had the people in the event prepared or evacuated. First responders can't be included for they run toward the event, it's the risk they willingly take by electing to do that job.

California's policies for clearing out deadwood which fuels wildfires helps but ignored by some communities. Hurricanes take days to reach an area. Tornadoes develop and hit within 5 minutes, enough time to take cover. Snow storms are known days in advance. Thunder storms (lightning strikes) can be seen coming at least 30 minutes in advance. Earthquakes, well, that not a weather event but  those do kill those who chose to live on or near faults. Volcanic eruptions today are known more than a few days in advance. Except for earthquakes, a non-weather event, there is time to take proper actions, including evacuating.

I'm not rationalizing anything, its life, the facts of life, living life, trying to stay alive. Each person is responsible for themselves, to protect themselves from harm, to take care of themselves. That can be done in many ways including not driving too fast on a snowy road regardless of past driving experience. Groucho was a mediocre comedian, Clint Eastwood was a B-movie pragmatist, "A Man's Got To Know His Limitations."

Weather does not kill, the actions of some people in a weather event gets them killed and if one of those was my brother or sister or parent or child, I'd have sympathy for them but forever wonder why they did not do what was necessary to protect their life. To blame the weather for their death was be just wrong (I did loose an uncle on Green Bay off of Dykesville when a freak storm came up capsizing his boat before he and his friend could reach shore and I lost a cousin who drove his Firebird off of a snow covered winding road into a tree in Shawano, Wisconsin killing himself - does that count for having lost a loved one?)

I don't buy into the alarmist media fear mongering so pervasive today intent on blaming deaths on something other than the person responsible just because it makes sensational headlines, increase time spent watching and raises rating. The driver of that truck was the person responsible for two deaths, not the weather.
            John . . .

              

Offline AE_Collector

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #785 on: January 04, 2018, 10:28:24 PM »
Everyone is probably analyzing the wording too much. Bad weather conditions set up the opportunity for people to push their luck beyond their point of no return.

I think we live in an age where everything that happens is someone or something else’s fault. No one takes responsibility for anything and as for being on the road I feel that people won’t adjust to conditions. They just carry on like normal as much as possible like they are on autopilot.

As for calling this east coast storm a weather bomb or other similar names, the weather scenario has happened before, nothing new there. I recall hearing this term used a year or two ago. Some weather agency (In my opinion) has simply come up with a name to specifically describe a specific weather condition rather than just calling it a storm. Just part of “the information age”. No malice by the media, no Fake News. There’s a whole plethora of “new words and phrases” popped up in the last year or more (including that one I just quoted) that I would love to see “deep sixed”!

Terry
« Last Edit: January 04, 2018, 10:33:05 PM by AE_Collector »

Offline TelePlay

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #786 on: January 04, 2018, 10:29:04 PM »
It snows more often than every 20 years in Raleigh and Carthage where one of the accidents took place. They've had some very bad snows in that area over the years and they should have the equipment to plow snow. But in this case it was ice on a bridge that caused the accident. A truck with two men skidded on an icy bridge. Yes, they could have been going too fast or had bald tires or any number of things, but the weather was a contributing factor and they broke through the guardrail and landed in the creek upside down in the icy water. Both men were found dead when the truck was pulled out of the creek. Below is a picture of the truck before it was pulled out.

Thanks for that. I wish the media would take the time to dive into the facts instead of crafting a sensational headline.

Ice on bridges and over passes is one of the scariest parts in any winter driving condition and condition of tires doesn't matter. I was the 7th vehicle in a 7 car pile up on an overpass in late March in 2010. It was a warm sunny day and the roads were clear but when the sun went down, the temperature dropped and the overpasses being below freezing began to accumulate the moisture in the air turning every overpass in half the county into glare ice in about 10 minutes. Over 60 multiple car accidents happened in a 30 minutes period and the sky was clear. Totaled the van after pumping the brakes and working the steering wheel to avoid 5 cars sitting on the overpass bumper to bumper and just clipped the back end of a singled car just sitting in the middle of the right lane, undamaged until I hit her. She stopped in the middle of the road as a witness and became a victim. After clipping her back corner, which caused her car to do 2 360° spins on the ice, I bounced into the concrete guard rail which kept the truck from going over onto the railroad tracks below. Busted up the front end with the two collisions. No one got hurt in the 25-30 mph crash, fortunately. Got images and video of the damage of all the vehicles to this day. That was weather being a contributing factor but poor driving by those in front of me was the cause. I was braking down well from 55 until my front tires hit the overpass and at that point, it was all over except for an emergency (panic) attempt to get the truck over two lanes in about 8 seconds.

One day I was half way back from a 250 mile cross state drive with my speed control on when I hit an area of black ice at 65 mph. The loss of traction caused the engine to speed up and the back end to want to come around. After 3 zig zags, I got the cruise of and it took another 3 zig zags to get the truck slowed down and straight. Never forget that fun event. Black ice is the most dangerous if all winter driving conditions. NEVER use a cruise control if it even looks like it might be a black ice day.

I think I had about 9 close calls in 15 years of driving 200 to 500 miles a day, 5 days a week and one on a windy spring day when the roof of a barn crossed the highway no more than 20 feet in front of me at eye level. Saw many more including fatalities. Not driving anymore and don't miss those days, rain or snow.

It's always sad and unfortunate when someone dies.

====

bombogenesis - the rapid reduction in barometric pressure (24 millibars over a 24 hour period) or the barometric pressure bombs out, falls, drops like a bomb - analogies. The word is slang used by meteorologists derived from cyclogenesis, a meteorological term. Unfortunately, a bomb is something the quickly releases energy, something quite different from the sensational tie to a weather event. Words mean something and for the media to use "bomb" and "most explosive" drop in that sense is alarmist malpractice on their part, but it gets good ratings, doesn't it, especially in this area of terrorism. It's just a nor'easter and I think the east coast get 2 to 5 nor'easters each winter, it just weather, high and lows interacting with the jet stream and the tilt of the planet away from the sun in the northern hemisphere during winter. This one is just a bit stronger than others. But it is not a bomb. A winter hurricane, if you will, but not a bomb.
            John . . .

              

Offline Fabius

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #787 on: January 05, 2018, 12:58:14 PM »
It's Snowageddon in La Porte Indiana. Being just 12 miles (as the crow flies) from Lake Michigan we are getting bombed by lake affect snow. Pictures taken out the kitchen window. Mailbox and Jeep.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 01:07:35 PM by Fabius »
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Offline 19and41

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #788 on: January 05, 2018, 01:15:47 PM »
15 degrees again this morning.  They are predicting it to be 55 by Tuesday.  I got out a new portable heater and threw away the box that morning, 2 days ago.  It's deader than a doornail now.  Meanwhile my 20 year old heater, a cheapie, made in Germany putts along.
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Offline AE_Collector

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #789 on: January 05, 2018, 01:25:09 PM »
Check the “tilt switch” required in the newer heaters.. I had a reasonably new heater that cooked its tilt switch. Not heavy duty enough for the constant current in a device that also gets hot on its own I guess. Not that one should bypass the safety feature but if needed to avoid frost bite .... Your old one isn’t going to have a tilt switch in it either.

Terry

Offline 19and41

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #790 on: January 05, 2018, 01:43:25 PM »
The new one has that and also an allegedly self re-settable overheat switch.  It was to reset in 20 minutes after cooling off unplugged.  Still croaked after 4 hours.  The furnace on it's own brings up the temp to 70.  With the little helpers, it gets to about 73.  I'm also the idiot in the south that bought and installed heat tapes on the water pipes.  They almost froze off in the 2012 storm.  I had to run the German heater in the crawlspace to bring them back from the brink,  I didn't want a repeat.  ;D
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Offline jsowers

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #791 on: January 05, 2018, 01:55:03 PM »
We had a low of 7 last night, and a greenhouse with a bad thermostat on the heater. It was running wide open yesterday afternoon and the cooling fan and vents were opening to exhaust the heat. My electric bill is going to be a whopper. I hope it didn't do that long. We have a kerosene heater out there now and a part on order for the electric heater. You wouldn't believe what online retailers ask for a thermostat. Anywhere from $71.50 to $216! It's a special control that goes inside an electric Modine heater and only has two wires and a temperature sensing bulb. The part is supposed to get here sometime after January 12th. Every place had it backordered.

My mom, who's 88, still gardens a lot and keeps her tender plants in the greenhouse. She's seeing the writing on the wall and is making plans to give away a lot of plants this spring, if she has any left after this. The greenhouse is 22 years old and I'm surprised it all lasted this long without much repair. And I'm the one footing the bill for electricity since it's behind my house.

I'm lucky to have a well-insulated basement and outside walls and no frozen pipes from the low temps. I have enough to worry with.
Jonathan

Offline 19and41

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #792 on: January 05, 2018, 03:19:31 PM »
I work for a transit authority here and the fire supression water systems have been bursting in some of our stations.  Most of our sprinklers fortunately, only have water when tripped.
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Offline dsk

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #793 on: January 05, 2018, 03:38:05 PM »
We have a sprinkler system in a building where frost is a risk in some lofts etc, there (those areas) do we have a special sprinkler system with compressed, air and a special valve so when a head is activated, and the pressure falls under a level, the water comes.  It is designed pretty many of those systems, and some of them are trustworthy. (luckily ours are).  Saves a lot of money in the long run.

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Re: Let it Snow...Let it Snow....Let it Snow ( and other weather events )
« Reply #794 on: January 05, 2018, 04:57:43 PM »
Today was sort of a break from the cold, being a whopping 10 degrees Fahrenheit! I don't think it's been this warm for a week or so!
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