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10-G Locks

Started by poplar1, August 13, 2016, 12:02:34 PM

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poplar1

U.S. Patent 1793254 is for the 10-G upper housing lock.
It was filed 6/29/28, issued 2/17/31.
Inventor: Oscar A. Shann
Assignee: Bell Telephone Labor[itories] Inc.

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/1793254.pdf

The purpose of the invention was to require keys that could not be easily duplicated by using flat blank keys available to locksmiths.

I recently acquired two 10-Gs with the patent numbers on the back. One is marked "10G" and the other "10-G."
A standard (repro) 10-G key will not fit one lock. The one on the left in the first picture has apparently been modified to enlarge the key opening, and this one will work with my 10-G key.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Very-Collectible-WESTERN-ELECTRIC-Cabinet-Lock-No-Keys-/142050503654
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

RotarDad

Poplar1 - Thanks so much for posting this detail!  These must be early 10G locks.  The addition of the "-" may indicate a date or time period.  I'm hoping one of our resident experts can shed more light on this - Stan S or Jim???
Paul

Stan S

Poplar and RotarDad
I'm sure if you use an original STEEL 10G key it will work fine in both locks. ALL THE REPRO BRASS KEYS that are being sold are pure crap. They have purposely been made thicker for two reasons:
1- The thicker brass stock is a standard 'off the shelf' size. CHEAPER!
2- A thicker key won't bend and snap off at the 'ward' cut, leaving the tip of the key imprisoned in the lock.
(Maybe someday someone is going to invest the 'big bucks' necessary to reproduce STEEL 10G keys).

You'll find that some 10G keys that were used in early Gray coin collectors had differently shaped nose pieces. Could account for the difference in the way they were marked???
If you use them on a 3-slot vault door the shape of the nose piece doesn't really matter. They mount in back of the door and don't go through it.

The only repro key I would use is a 29S. You can put them on a belt sander or a grinding wheel and thin them out. They don't have a deep 'ward' cut so the key can be made thin without worrying about them breaking in the lock. However, I would still go very easy with those keys.

I wouldn't put a repro brass 10G key in a vintage 10G lock on a bet.

Stan S.

poplar1

Stan, thanks for the info. Perhaps Dick Pitzer will start making the steel keys, if he isn't already doing so.

Any idea which lock is older? The lock marked "10 G" is on the left in all 3 pictures. The "10-G", with the letters spaced further apart and the two bosses on the back, is on the right in all 3 pictures.
"C'est pas une restauration, c'est une rénovation."--François Martin.

RotarDad

#4
Thanks, Stan.  Poplar1,  I recently purchased a couple repro 10G keys from Dick - maybe 3-4 months back.  Those were brass, and he did thin the metal a bit at the top, consistent with Stan's comment about the stock being too thick.  I use one in a vintage 10G with no issues, but I am very careful to always apply inward pressure on the upper housing to prevent drag on the lock. A good graphite-based lock lube is essential as well, imo.
Paul

Stan S

Poplar
I have no idea which lock is older. To me it makes no difference. These days ANY 10G lock is like GOLD!

There was a time when I used brass repro keys in 10G locks. When the key broke in the lock I just took the lock out of the payphone and tossed it in the garbage. The 10G locks were $10 each. Dealers had 55 gallon drums full of them. There were so many that they were actually being scrapped for the value of the brass. How times have changed!  I own four steel 10G keys. I keep the keys under lock and key!!

The problem with keys breaking isn't really an issue with collectors. However, when you sell payphones on Ebay it is a really big problem. I actually supply instructions on how to push back on the top of the payphone with one hand while you turn the key in the lock with the other hand. I include a picture of which way the key goes in the lock. Cuts up, cuts down. I've had idiots break the keys trying to get them in the locks upside down. No, I'm not kidding!

I wish Dick Pitzer luck. The cost of the key blanks isn't what's expensive. Steel wears out the cutters in the key machines like crazy. Those cutters are expensive. Those who know will probably pay any price for a repro steel key. Beats destroying a 10G lock. The problem is that audience is fairly limited.

Stan S.

RotarDad

#6
Stan - Now I better understand why you normally install a 29S lock in your Ebay listed WE payphones - just a little insurance toward reducing post-sale issues.... Thanks for the explanation on the scarcity of steel keys also.

Poplar1 - Update: I was able to check my 10G lock, and it has no dash, and also has the patent number like your two.  Mine has the 3 circles on the lock "bolt" like the left one in your pic.  Mine has a black painted face like yours also, but I have no idea how old it is.  It came from Dick Pitzer as a separate part. Do the 3 circles have something to do with a hardening process?  If so, that may indicate a later improvement.

My other upper locks are both 10H.  I can't check now if they have a dash - not sure that would help anyway.  I'm pretty sure the H locks don't have any patent number on them.
Paul