AE 92-W-55 w/WE Dial Question

[Connu]

I got a good deal on this 92-W-55 as a parts phone (mostly the locks).  I had never heard of this "W" version before, but I found a wiring diagram and technical information from an old Automatic Electric bulletin.  It turns out that it not only used Western Electric internal electronics, but it also specified a WE dial versus an "N" version that also used WE parts, but an AE dial.  I had decided not to collect payphone with the square vault housing, but the fact that it cleaned up so well and the tech bulletin specified a dual coin relay, I decided to give this one a go.

Of course, it had been converted in the 60's to an LPC with a Teltronics board.  I've got the inside figured out, but mounting a WE dial has me stumped.  What shroud and daisy would have allowed AE to factory install a WE dial on a standard AE steel upper housing?  Has anyone seen this before other than on an AE 150GJ or older Gray phones?  I'd really like to get it back to its original factory configuration.

[MMikeJBenN27]

Does it say "Western Electric Company, Inc."?  If so, this is one of those reproductions made by a company called Phone Co.

Mike

[Connu]

Does it say "Western Electric Company, Inc."?  If so, this is one of those reproductions made by a company called Phone Co.

I'm not sure where you mean.  Only the dial that I added is marked Western Electric.  This is a legitimate AE model and one of the first ones in 1958 that had a square vault, anti-stuffing return, and was stamped with the Northlake, ILL. factory location as pictured.  The 92W is a well-documented version of the 92 series alongside the 92N.  What isn't clear is whether it left the factory with a WE dial or was simply WE dial ready for independent service providers to add in the field.  I've discussed this with Mike Davis, and he seems to think the later.  He believes it would have shipped with large 3/8" black slotless screws to cover the unused AE shroud holes like his AE 150GJC that would have been left exposed after installing a WE shroud.

The WE cast metal shroud and dial fit perfectly on the AE upper housing but leave the shroud holes empty as pictured.  A quick AI search reveals that there was a stamped metal conversion plate, p/n D-530224-A, that AE made to better mount the WE shroud without simply relying on the dial screws to pinch the shroud to the housing.

Quick Reference for Dial Adapters

WE Dial to AE Housing: D-530224-A
AE Dial to WE Housing: H886062-1

I can find the H886062-1 at oldphoneworks.com, but I can't find anything regarding the D-530224-A.  Perhaps it's just an AI hallucination?

[Connu]

Here's a closeup of Mike's 150GJC WE dial and the decorative slotless screws to fill the unused threaded holes in the AE upper housing.  This phone came from a factory sealed box.  It's flawless and completely original.

[MMikeJBenN27]

It is embossed "Automatic Electric, Inc."?  That's good.  A company called Phone Co. sold a lot of AE pay phones that were embossed "Western Electric Company, Inc." in that spot, leading many people to believe that they were Western Electric pay phones, when they were not.  Good that your's is unaltered, except for the dial.

Mike

[Stan S]

Connu Have you noticed that you ask a question and the answers you get make absolutely no sense? AE used the standard Western shroud and dial on that payphone. Probably a 56 shroud and a number 5 or 6 dial. Over the years I owned a few AES with Western dials. Every one of them had slotless screws in the three extra holes.

[Connu]

Probably a 56 shroud and a number 5 or 6 dial. Over the years I owned a few AES with Western dials. Every one of them had slotless screws in the three extra holes.

My understanding is that they used the WE 5 dial rather than the 6 even though the 6 had been announced and probably released. That can be extrapolated from the wiring diagrams that clearly show the screw lug pattern of a WE 5 dial.  I found a full GTE TCI document from 1969 that makes it clear that these were shipped with dials and that these models were apparently widely distributed.  I've attached the PDF.  After I took off the paint and grime, I had a nearly perfect factory finish (original Japan black varnish) and an AE tag I had never seen before.  I decided to take a stab at getting back to the original 1957/58 build as it would have rolled off the factory line.  The beauty in these phones isn't in the rarity of some models; it's in the beautiful finish, simplicity of design, and bombproof builds that we no longer see in our modern throwaway culture.

[Connu]

Other than this dial and shroud, I haven't collected Western Electric up to this point.  The shroud I used is a 63.  What is the difference between the 63 and 56 you suggested?  It's tough to tell from pictures.  It looks like it might be the depth of the shroud since later dials like the WE 6 are also deeper, especially given their protective plastic dust cover.

[Stan S]

A 63 shroud is probably correct. It would depend on when your payphone was manufactured.

[Connu]

The phone is dated 1957 and 1958 on the backboard and upper housing.  Is there a significant difference between the 56 and 63 shroud?

[Stan S]

Connu  56A on the lefr 63A on the right.
 
See attached.

[Connu]

Thanks Stan.  I went with the 63.  I can't imagine they used the 56 in the new 1957 Northlake facilities, but you never know.  There is AE documentation that shows they shipped with the older WE 5H dial.