WE 51AL Frankenstein?

[NY Collector Geek]

Hi all, first post in the forum after lurking for the past few weeks. Lots of good stuff In here!

I picked up my first candlestick phone, a Western Electric rotary, at an estate auction a couple of months ago and finally found some to time to really examine it. I'm no expert, but what I found doesn't seem to make sense to me, so I'm looking for some help to determine just how many mods have been made to it over the past hundred years and why. It's stamped "51AL" on the perch, but what I found doesn't match the descriptions and photos of other 51ALs I found online.

First anomaly I noticed is that it has a rubber coated 3-conductor coiled receiver cord (with only 2 wires in use) not the fabric covered 2-conductor cord I'd expect. And the receiver is a 706A, which my research shows is from the 1940s, not the '20s when this phone model was put into service. And it's missing the receiver element, further evidence that someone has had their hands into this unit. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the correct receiver for this phone would have been a 144 with a magnetic element.

Once inside, the mystery deepens. There is a silver component marked "Western Electric Made in USA" wired between terminals Y and BK on the dial, which I have not seen in any of the online photos I found of 51ALs. The two non-fabric covered wires shown in the pictures go to the receiver's coiled cord, which we already know is not original.

At this point I'm scratching my head over just exactly what I have on my hands, and if it can even be made operational.

Please see the pictures; any and all advice is welcomed!

Thanks!
Frank in NY

[TelePlay]

The red circled item, you can search the Forum for "61A Filter" for many discussions.

Here's one link:

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=19459.0

[SUnset2]

The 706A was commonly used as a replacement.  It is missing one of the contact springs, and the HA1 receiver element.  You could borrow these out of a type F handset.

[paul-f]

... the receiver is a 706A, which my research shows is from the 1940s, not the '20s when this phone model was put into service.
<snip>

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the correct receiver for this phone would have been a 144 with a magnetic element.

The Bell System was a master at extending the life of their installed products by upgrading product features and components as technology improved. The components in products coming off the production line evolved and sets in service were refurbished with later components to extend their useful lifetime.

WE upright desk stands (candlesticks) were in service for many years and had component changes during their lifetime -- all perfectly legitimate. Due to manufacturing restrictions and material shortages, sets were refurbished through WWII with the transmitter and receiver elements from the F-type handsets, as mentioned above.

A set with the 706 receiver would also likely have the updated transmitter, nicknamed a "bulldog" as seen in the photo below and in this forum topic:

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=17306.msg178497#msg178497

The 2AE dial shown would originally have had a 132E number plate for party line service. Note the numbers and letters in the photo below. Since a number 2 dial has an outside fingerstop, the original plate was circular, with no notch for the later internal fingerstop.

For context, number plates from earlier and later dials are summarized here:

http://www.paul-f.com/weNumberPlates.html#Chart

Like receivers, transmitters, dial and cords, number plates were easily changed when the set was refurbished for single line service, and the notched number plates were used, as they were in current production.

[NY Collector Geek]

Thanks, that's a huge help as well as a great history lesson.  So it's possible that this particular piece was upgraded by Bell and not just cobbled together by some tinkerer.

A set with the 706 receiver would also likely have the updated transmitter, nicknamed a "bulldog" as seen in the photo below and in this forum topic:

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=17306.msg178497#msg178497

Although it's clear that the receiver has been replaced with a more modern version, I'm not so sure about the transmitter. Do these pictures look like the updated transmitter you mentioned (mouthpiece removed for clarity)?

[NY Collector Geek]

The 706A was commonly used as a replacement.  It is missing one of the contact springs, and the HA1 receiver element.  You could borrow these out of a type F handset.

Thanks, I had noticed the missing element and spring, but wanted to be sure that a 706A was an appropriate receiver for a 51AL before looking for the replacement parts to put it back together.

Frank in NY

[TelePlay]

Although it's clear that the receiver has been replaced with a more modern version, I'm not so sure about the transmitter. Do these pictures look like the updated transmitter you mentioned (mouthpiece removed for clarity)?

It looks like the candlestick transmitter was upgraded to the WE 300 series type (323), the last and best carbon capsule diaphragm made by WE.

Here's one of several topics about it on the Forum (search 300 series transmitter to see other topics).

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=27951.msg268573#msg268573

The transmitter that was taken out was most likely a 200 series transmitter.

These transmitters were replaced by the Bulldog style transmitter that used the next generation of transmitters, the F1 element, as seen above in Paul's reply.

[TelePlay]

Here's a good discussion of the 323 transmitter:

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=14651.0

It has good advice on removal and installation from a member who knows transmitter restoration well.

[NY Collector Geek]

The red circled item, you can search the Forum for "61A Filter" for many discussions.

Here's one link:

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=19459.0

Thanks for the info. It doesn't appear to be a 61A since it has only 2 black wires, but I'm guessing it serves a similar purpose and was installed when the phone was upgraded.

Thanks for your help!
Frank in NY

[TelePlay]

It doesn't appear to be a 61A since it has only 2 black wires, but I'm guessing it serves a similar purpose and was installed when the phone was upgraded.

There was one (don't know the unit number) that fit into the handset (no leads) which was only a capacitor

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=12818.msg143606#msg143606

and the 3 wire type found in the desk set with 3 wired used as an RF filter.

If yours only has two leads, it might be a capacitor (do you have a DVM that measures capacitance to check that out?).

Others with access to BSP's or the TCI library could give better advice.

[NY Collector Geek]

There was one (don't know the unit number) that fit into the handset (no leads) which was only a capacitor

https://www.classicrotaryphones.com/forum/index.php?topic=12818.msg143606#msg143606

and the 3 wire type found in the desk set with 3 wired used as an RF filter.

If yours only has two leads, it might be a capacitor (do you have a DVM that measures capacitance to check that out?).

Others with access to BSP's or the TCI library could give better advice.

Unfortunately none of my multimeters can measure capacitance.  When I get a chance later, I'll pull it out to see if there's any identification stamped on the underside that might be helpful. But at this point I'm assuming it's a filter of some sort.

[MMikeJBenN27]

That gizmo wired to the dial is a radio interference filter, and the receiver housing is a newer one that allows the use of a modern, (at the time), receiver capsule, and the 3-wire cord is a replacement, as the correct cord would have only 2 wires. 

Mike

[paul-f]

... It doesn't appear to be a 61A since it has only 2 black wires, but I'm guessing it serves a similar purpose and was installed when the phone was upgraded.

Anxiously awaiting to see if there's a marking on the other side of the unit.

In the meantime, I came across this catalog card for the 152A Condenser, which is listed as an equivalent for the 61-type filters. It has two wires, so may be a possible match.

[TelePlay]

Good find, Paul.

Dimensions are 1" by 1" by 5/16" so could be measured in place, a quick test/check before removing it so see what's on the bottom, and a picture of that posted for reference.

[poplar1]

It looks like the candlestick transmitter was upgraded to the WE 300 series type (323), the last and best carbon capsule diaphragm made by WE.
[snip]
The transmitter that was taken out was most likely a 200 series transmitter.

The original transmitter would have been a #323, #329, or #337.  (The first two screenshots are from TCI Library.)

Your #337 transmitter has a 2 31 date on the back -- not sure if that is a manufacture date or a retest date.
Your phone was originally assembled in 4 29 (4th Quarter of 1929).