Dialgizmo Hookup Problem

[black AE 50]

Now, can I upload schematic 1? Please forgive the jumbled order.

[poplar1]

Is that 2 plug cord a straight through, or a cross cable?
maybe you got a polarity issue?
just a guess.
A pic or 3 may help also.
[/quote

The 4-conductor cord with plugs on both ends reverses polarity. This is not a problem when used with a biscuit jack (baseboard) on one end and a 623-type jack inside a telephone, since the gold pins in the 623 are arranged to reverse polarity again. Thus green is + in both the biscuit jack and on L1 in the telephone, and red is - in both.

However, when using 2 biscuit jacks, and a 2- or 4-conductor cord between the 2 jacks, you have to swap red and green inside the second jack (or inside the phone). You should also remember to do this when adding a biscuit jack to the end of a line cord of a hardwired phone.

[poplar1]

Now, can I upload schematic 1? Please forgive the jumbled order.

How is the 2nd floor (Sony) jack connected to the rest of the house wiring?

Which color wires are connected inside the AE 50, and to which screw terminals inside the phone?

[black AE 50]

poplar1

Thanks for staying with this. If, as RB suggested, I may have a polarity issue, would it allow one phone (the AE 50) to function while, with essentially the same hook up, the other phone (Sony) goes dead? Also note that the Dialgizmo won't work on that line either.

The Sony phone is plugged into a standard surface jack in the upstairs bedroom. The line from the jack goes through the wall and runs down the outside of the house to the Verizon network interface box.

I have made a schematic of the line wiring inside the AE 50. Apparently there is no 623 type jack inside the phone. The wiring was done by a Verizon technician that my wife managed to cajole into hooking up the phone. The red wire is attached to the screw below L1. The yellow wire is attached to the screw below GRD. The Green wire is attached to the screw below L2. The black wire is not attached and probably has been clipped off as it isn't visible.

Sincerely,
black AE 50

[poplar1]

Polarity should not matter on a rotary phone.

Wiring seems to be correct on the AE 50, though you need only 2 wires: Ground (yellow) was needed only for certain party lines.

So, the jack in the basement (the one with the feed from the telco interface) does not work with the Sony plugged into it (Figure 3)? This implies that something is wired differently in one or both basement jacks. Waiting to see what happens when you disconnect the yellow and black wires from these jacks, as Paul advised.

[black AE 50]

poplar1,

Step 1: I disconnected the yellow and black wires from both basement jacks. The AE 50 went dead. I then interposed the Dialgizmo but the phone was still dead.

Step 2: I brought the Sony into the basement and hooked it up. It too was dead. Interposing the Dialgizmo made no difference.

Step 3: I reconnected the yellow wires to both basement jacks but left the black wires unconnected. I rehooked up the AE 50. Still dead. Interposing the Dialgizmo made no difference.

Step 4: I repeated step 3 with the Sony (with and without interposing the Dialgizmo). Phone dead.

Step 5: I reconnected the black wires to both basement jacks and dial tone was restored to the AE 50.

Step 6: I disconnected the yellow wires from both basement jacks and the AE 50 went dead. I didn't bother to interpose the Dialgizmo.

Step 7: I repeated step 6 with the Sony. Phone dead.

Given the above, it would appear that, for some reason, both the yellow and black wires are needed for the AE 50 to function. It would also appear that the Sony won't work on the AE 50 line whether either or both of the black and yellow wires are connected or disconnected.

Sincerely,
black AE 50

[poplar1]

OK. I misread your previous reply, thinking the Sony worked in Schematic 3, but it did not. You said it did work in Schematic 2, but was the Sony in the basement or upstairs? Not surprising if it still worked upstairs since that jack is hardwired directly to the outside Verizon box.

Why would the yellow and black wires need to be connected if the black wire is cut off inside the AE 50 and the ground terminal in the AE 50 has no other wires other than the solid copper yellow wire from the basement?

[black AE 50]

poplar1,

You are correct about schematic 2. It is implied that the Sony is hooked up to the surface jack which is in turn hooked up directly to the Verizon interface box outside the house. I have not been able to make the Sony work when connected to the AE 50 line in the basement.

As for the AE 50, I find it very puzzling indeed to need to have the yellow wires attached in the basement surface jacks when the only yellow wire connection inside the phone is to a ground. I am COMPLETELY baffled however as to why the black wires need to be attached in the basement surface jacks when the black wire DOESN'T EVEN APPEAR TO BE CONNECTED INSIDE THE PHONE. I will open up the AE 50 again to see if the black wire is attached to some hidden connection (but I doubt it).

Sincerely,
black AE 50

[black AE 50]

After my last post, I decided to see if any of the local business telecom companies would be willing to tackle my problem because I was at a loss to figure it out. Save for one, all of the companies I contacted did business installations only. The sole company willing to take a shot wanted $400 just to "have a look" and wouldn't guarantee success. Things were looking pretty grim until I remembered that the tech that has fixed my computers for years recently mentioned that he also did security system installations. I gave him a call. His rates were reasonable and he felt that he could fix the problem.  He was able to trace the circuit and found that the tip and ring coming from the phone were actually carried by the black and yellow wires. He then confirmed my finding that the yellow and black wires in the phone line were connected at the punch down box and the red and green wires were tied off. He disconnected the yellow and black wires, connected the red and green wires and then rewired the rest of the line as shown in the schematic. When I first made the schematic, I couldn't make it work logically until I realized that, contrary to what I previously believed,  the visible red, green, and yellow wires connected to the L1, L2, and GRD terminals respectively are not part of the main phone line but actually belong to a line located inside the phone only.  The other ends of the wires in this internal line connect to terminals (probably 4) on a hidden terminus (probably on the the back of phone).  The actual phone line also connects to this hidden terminus via the black and yellow wires. I have not actually seen this hidden terminus and am not about to take the phone down to check it out but the schematic shows that there is only one other possible alternative: An ordinary man with an extraordinary old phone ... newly wired to receive calls through a switchboard located in...the Twilight Zone. My money is on the hidden terminus. I have added it to the schematic (indicated by dashed lines and faded colors).

[Key2871]

Well tip and ring being on two separate wires would explain why it didn't work.
So you got everything straightened out and it all works as it should?

This is a case where a butt set would come in very handy, so you can verify what pair is being used to carry the phone signal.

Did you wire the punch block and pairs? Or did someone else do those.
I've found instances before where someone who didn't know how to connect the proper pair in the home before and I found it via a butt set. Now you can use a regular phone, it helps to modify the end with gator clips so they can simply be clipped onto a pair with out having to hard wire the set.
Some handy in for you in the future so you can solve problems more easily.